[kj] "Absolute Dissent": The Loudness Wars

Rob Moss rob.moss at gmx.com
Wed Oct 27 18:42:15 EDT 2010


These days you can record in your bedroom with a cheap pc and a few mikes.

Digital era recording of analogue bands suffers. AD is not perfect but it hits the mark. In analogue days I think you would shit your pants!

Listen to the last two stranglers albums to hear it being stretched at the seams.

Headcount are guilty of it too by the way.

Everyone is a producer. Everyone is an engineer.



On 27 Oct 2010, at 22:29, Paul Wady <paulwady at hotmail.com> wrote:


> Nothing wrong with AD! What are they going on about?

>

> Consider - Big Paul's victorious driving drums at the end of Raven King?

>

> The driving guitars background to In Excelsis, the kinda wall-of-sound ones in the background?

>

> The sheer detail of the environment that is Ghosts of Ladbroke Grove?

>

> The floating quality of European Super State?

>

> The beautiful metal rasps at the start and the breaks of Endgame?

>

> What do they want? Perfectly good production I think. ALL THOSE LITTLE DETAILS THAT MAKE FOR GREAT? I think they struck a good balance away from Hosannas and closer to KJ2003 me self?

>

> Killing Joke is not some sort of Stock Aitken and Waterman. It is a raw, real 5 piece. Kylie survives on great production!! Linkin Park...............

>

> Rough edges are everything.

>

>

>

> THE SCENE: BRITANNIA ROW. THE BOYS ARE DEBATING THEIR LATEST WORKS.

>

>

> JEREMY: Oooh, Kevin dear, do ask the nice sonic production engineer to boost your upper G chords by one fifth of their tonality? It will so improve the overall timbre and production of our work.

>

> GEORDIE: **** off you ponce.....

>

> YOUTH: Just hide his lithium mate. Tee hee....

>

>

>

>

>

> From: folk.devil at hotmail.com

> To: gathering at misera.net

> Date: Wed, 27 Oct 2010 11:24:55 -0700

> Subject: Re: [kj] "Absolute Dissent": The Loudness Wars

>

> There's a difference between rough edges and crap recording. Extremities might as well have been d/i to their home stereo..

>

> Date: Wed, 27 Oct 2010 11:03:46 -0700

> From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com

> To: gathering at misera.net

> Subject: Re: [kj] "Absolute Dissent": The Loudness Wars

>

> > Extremities - abomination

> I say Nyet on that, for the same reason - "Rough edges are nice," - among others. I think if they would've cleaned it up any further it would damage the album.

> That said, on certain songs ("Extremities..") the range of volume level (or whatever music techs call it) between loudest and softest parts (redundancy 4 emphasis? ha!) is enough to startle some listeners and maybe even affect the speakers if they're already turned up pretty loud. That, I think should've been improved.

>

>

>

> From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>

> To: gathering at misera.net

> Sent: Wed, October 27, 2010 10:45:55 AM

> Subject: Re: [kj] "Absolute Dissent": The Loudness Wars

>

> Hosannas - abomination

> Extremities - abomination

> Fire Dances - abomination

>

> My biggest gripe with KJ production is the bass treatment.

>

> I'll give AD a 7 or 8 out of 10.

>

> However, I typically hate really squeaky clean production. Nor do I like 'mastering' that is effectively tubing the whole thing to constant loudness.

> Rough edges are nice.

>

> Date: Wed, 27 Oct 2010 13:18:30 -0400

> From: vassifer at earthlink.net

> To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net

> Subject: Re: [kj] "Absolute Dissent": The Loudness Wars

>

> "the production is an abomination."

> These fools obviously never listened to HOSANNAS.

> Alex in NYC

>

>

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Rheinhold Squeegee

> Sent: Oct 27, 2010 1:14 PM

> To: Gathering Gathering

> Subject: [kj] "Absolute Dissent": The Loudness Wars

>

> Not interested in starting a flamewar here since the answer is pretty subjective, but I've been seeing a lot of comments from YouTube, Amazon etc. where a few very indignant individuals insist that while "AD" may be decent, the production is an abomination.

>

> Most interestingly, they cite KJ (1980) as an example of "good" KJ production when, to me, it sounds like it was recorded in a fish tank down the hall. I have also seen "HFTBOH" cited as well-produced, when it's obvious (again, to me) that they just drove the needles into the red and left them there. Very one-note with no subtlety at all.

>

> I get the whole "Loudness Wars" thing, but that's a mastering, rather than production, issue, isn't it? CDs have a set peak and you can only give the perception of exceeding that peak through signal compression.

>

> I'll be the first to admit that I'm deaf as a post, but this album "sounds" as good as any I've heard. I have been able to pick out levels of nuance in songs like "Ghosts of Ladbroke Grove" that I had never experienced with another KJ disc. I have listened to it loud in the car, at normal room volume, and with headphones.

>

> I have always appreciated the "chaos" of their sound and I would never want to experience KJ with the type of clinical separation that I hear in the (limited) amount of modern metal I've actually listened to. I like the fact that they sound like they're in the process of falling off a cliff. KJ (1980) wouldn't have the same resonance if it had been produced under better circumstances.

>

> Is there anyone on this list with expertise in recording and production who can comment? Can someone who thinks "AD" sounds bad reccommend a similar disc that they think sounds "good"? What KJ albums are well-produced?

>

> Discuss.

>

>

>

>

> _______________________________________________ Gathering mailing list Gathering at misera.net http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

>

>

> _______________________________________________ Gathering mailing list Gathering at misera.net http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

> _______________________________________________ Gathering mailing list Gathering at misera.net http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

> _______________________________________________

> Gathering mailing list

> Gathering at misera.net

> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://four.pairlist.net/pipermail/gathering/attachments/20101027/5232ffb9/attachment-0001.htm>


More information about the Gathering mailing list