[kj] Gathering Digest, Vol 101, Issue 33

Dominico C dominicoc at hotmail.com
Thu Dec 29 22:36:59 EST 2011


Live albums take me back to feeling the concerts. I like the raw energy with
live shows. And you catch unique one off performances from bands. Albeit, it
depends on the band playing. Some bands just suck horrible, but put out
great studio albums and EPs.







-----Original Message-----
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Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2011 7:18 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Gathering Digest, Vol 101, Issue 33

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The Gathering - Digest

Today's Topics:

1. Re: It's a Boxing Day miracle! (Paul Rangecroft)
2. Re: It's a Boxing Day miracle! (Peter Moltesen)
3. Re: It's a Boxing Day miracle! (Karen Weil)
4. Old new is old? (Stephen Robinson)
5. OT - ARTIST JAMES RIZZI DIES AT 61 (sade1)
6. OT - Songs for a new post-Crash generation (sade1)


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Message: 1
Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2011 11:58:33 +0000
From: Paul Rangecroft <paul.rangecroft at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [kj] It's a Boxing Day miracle!
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)"
<gathering at misera.net>
Message-ID:
<CAAuMVT_VdJFOqwtR1SpYi+Jhb4L3-ngGZOSfkQ2bjL0UyXoVGA at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"

Hi Peter.

No, I think studio albums are different. The point of a studio album is for
the band/artist to get the music as close to how they want it to sound as
possible.

If there is a point to live albums then it must be to capture something of
the essence of the gig. Bootlegs are usually terrible quality (I had to
reassure my ex, who had heard lots of bootlegs but had never been to a
show, that they really didn't sound that bad live before she went to her
first concert!) and I can't get to that many dates on a tour so I want live
albums to be authentic but sound good. I don't mind amplifying crowd noises
or editing out any little mistakes but I don't see the justification for
anything beyond that.

If I want to hear the best possible version of a song I'll just listen to
the studio version. Live albums should put you in the crowd, not convince
you that the band were much better on the night than they actually were.

On Tue, Dec 27, 2011 at 10:56 PM, Peter Moltesen
<sneakypete at uwclub.net>wrote:


>

>

> Should live albums be genuinely live, or should they sound as good as

> possible?

>

>

>

> Should studio albums be recorded with the band playing straight through in

> the studio without overdubs too?

>

> I?ve not got a problem with overdubbed live albums ? if the end result

> justifies the means does it really matter?

>

> If I want to know what a band sounds like live I?ll go and see them and /

> or listen to bootlegs

>

> Peter

>

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Message: 2
Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2011 13:08:20 -0000
From: "Peter Moltesen" <sneakypete at uwclub.net>
Subject: Re: [kj] It's a Boxing Day miracle!
To: "'A list about all things Killing Joke \(the band!\)'"
<gathering at misera.net>
Message-ID: <20111228130804.4EC1E10686 at mailwash5.pair.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hi Paul



Fair enough I guess with regard to studio albums - I would completely agree.
I can think of many great studio albums that could

never be played live.



With regard to live albums, though - all I can say is that two of my all
time favourite live albums, namely (and please don't laugh too much ;o) are

Judas Priest's Unleashed in the East and Thin Lizzy's Live and Dangerous -
both of which are now well known to be crawling with

overdubs. This doesn't bother me as the songs on each are far better than
their original studio counterparts, in my opinion.

I have plenty of (early, I would hasten to add) Priest & Lizzy bootlegs to
delve into if the urge takes me!!



Peter



_____

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Paul Rangecroft
Sent: 28 December 2011 11:59
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] It's a Boxing Day miracle!



Hi Peter.

No, I think studio albums are different. The point of a studio album is for
the band/artist to get the music as close to how they want it to sound as
possible.

If there is a point to live albums then it must be to capture something of
the essence of the gig. Bootlegs are usually terrible quality (I had to
reassure my ex, who had heard lots of bootlegs but had never been to a show,
that they really didn't sound that bad live before she went to her first
concert!) and I can't get to that many dates on a tour so I want live albums
to be authentic but sound good. I don't mind amplifying crowd noises or
editing out any little mistakes but I don't see the justification for
anything beyond that.

If I want to hear the best possible version of a song I'll just listen to
the studio version. Live albums should put you in the crowd, not convince
you that the band were much better on the night than they actually were.

On Tue, Dec 27, 2011 at 10:56 PM, Peter Moltesen <sneakypete at uwclub.net>
wrote:



Should live albums be genuinely live, or should they sound as good as
possible?



Should studio albums be recorded with the band playing straight through in
the studio without overdubs too?

I've not got a problem with overdubbed live albums - if the end result
justifies the means does it really matter?

If I want to know what a band sounds like live I'll go and see them and / or
listen to bootlegs

Peter

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Message: 3
Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2011 16:07:13 -0800
From: "Karen Weil" <karen.weil at sddt.com>
Subject: Re: [kj] It's a Boxing Day miracle!
To: "'A list about all things Killing Joke \(the band!\)'"
<gathering at misera.net>
Message-ID: <000d01ccc5bd$d107ec70$7317c550$@weil at sddt.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Dear John: Don't let a certain chap in Hungerford see this. You'll start a
war. ; )



k.w.







From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of jon chapman
Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2011 2:48 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] It's a Boxing Day miracle!



I can say something that is FACT, Porcupine Tree are fucking dreadful.








_____

From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2011 11:23:08 +1300
Subject: Re: [kj] It's a Boxing Day miracle!

Okay someone tell me it's not true about these guys (PT), cos if it is.a
baby kitten just died somewhere:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WeegedVToRQ



( Feel free to replace the kitten in the metaphor with a mammal to which you
are more sympathetic, such as a baby dolphin...)



From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Alexander Smith
Sent: Wednesday, 28 December 2011 2:38 a.m.
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] It's a Boxing Day miracle!





I think even the most celebrated live albums out there have overdubbing.
It's a bit like believing in Santa Claus. If you want to dispel your
inherent cynicism and buy into to the theory that x-band really sounds that
dynamic in the live setting, it's there for you to believe. But even if the
finished product involves some sneaky "finishing touches" applied in a
studio -- does that make the document any less nice to listen to? (i.e. even
when you find out Santa doesn't exist, that doesn't mean you stop getting
presents).



Alex in NYC





On Dec 27, 2011, at 8:20 AM, Paul Rangecroft wrote:



Will need to have a proper listen with headphones. Can't decide if I think
that's right or wrong! Should live albums be genuinely live, or should they
sound as good as possible?

On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 10:23 PM, Rob Moss <rob.moss at gmx.com> wrote:



Wondering if the guitars have been dubbed in places?



On 26 Dec 2011, at 19:15, Paul Rangecroft <paul.rangecroft at gmail.com> wrote:

Listening to Down By The River
<http://www.pledgemusic.com/projects/killingjoke/updates/8007> .



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Message: 4
Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2011 18:12:44 -0000
From: "Stephen Robinson" <heiferboy at robinsonworld.freeserve.co.uk>
Subject: [kj] Old new is old?
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)"
<gathering at misera.net>
Message-ID: <op.v69jjicdmkgta6 at maureen-tosh>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15; format=flowed;
delsp=yes

Anyone seen this set of very interesting interviews with Mr. Walker?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDxJp3dI1aA

You can find the rest from that one


------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2011 18:32:00 -0800 (PST)
From: sade1 <saulomar1 at yahoo.com>
Subject: [kj] OT - ARTIST JAMES RIZZI DIES AT 61
To: REAL the <gathering at misera.net>
Message-ID:
<1325212320.36674.YahooMailNeo at web110202.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

He did nice work. Seems he had a lot more left in him, too.
He's the artist who also did the coverwork?for Tom Tom Club's?
self-titled album and the Genius Of Love video.
?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-16352779

http://blog.zap2it.com/pop2it/2011/12/artist-james-rizzi-dies-at-61.html
?
In other art-related news, it seems the Pasadena New Year's Parade float for
an organ-donor organization will be using a backwards-ticking clock. Kewl..
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Message: 6
Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2011 19:18:35 -0800 (PST)
From: sade1 <saulomar1 at yahoo.com>
Subject: [kj] OT - Songs for a new post-Crash generation
To: REAL the <gathering at misera.net>
Message-ID:
<1325215115.5820.YahooMailNeo at web110213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Universe??,? or Universe $?
The Beautiful Fed(eral Reserve)
Money is So?Our God now
Taaaa-lking?With Jobs (Steve)
Europeans' Uber-State/(b-side: You?re A Peon Underfoot remix)
Rage Of Need ( "..ought to Occupy, ought to Occupy!" )
?(nr)on????
Kiss My Internet Goodbye
Redundancies, TARP, & Various Repossessed Foreclosures
Pension ("..and the pension builds!")
The Weigghhht!? (of gold)
A Few Pay? ?(little or no taxes)
Total Evasion
You'll Never Get To Me (in my Caribbean offshore tax haven)
Writeout!? Writeout!? Writeout!...
Shop-shop
Being Fed
The Death & Debt-Collection Show
Another Bloody Kardashian!
Kiss My 401K Goodbye
Medicine Bill (?He sees his Medicine Bill, he writes a new living Will..?)
The Mock'racy
Wreck-We-Them
End-Times Song
Feast Of Craze
Remuneration
Change (?Hope is for the Loser!?)
Savagery Done (?From the bankers of Wall Street/ to the pillage of Life/tis
savage'ry done, I know / tis savage'ry done, I know?)
Loose*erm* Change
The ($88 million Central Park pent-)House That Gain Built
[w/lisp?] Thong And Danthe ?(gotta do what you have to for rent)
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