[kj] NYC Reviews? sound issues

ceplaster at aol.com ceplaster at aol.com
Mon Dec 6 00:37:30 EST 2010


All your points are valid, however, you are totally overthinking this. In Boston, Youths bass rig wasn't loud enough to cause phase issues with the pa sound. The problem was that the bass sound coming off the rig was pretty good, and the sound coming through the pa was shit. Here's what you do... You listen to the bass sound on stage, then find a mike that makes it sound the same way through the pa. If it doesn't sound close, try another mike. The mike they were using on the bass rig (BETA 52) has a huge low end sound with virtually all of the midrange sucked out of it. Sounds great on its own, but as soon as you turn the rest of the mix on it disappears, as all of the midrange info has been dialed out. They used the same mike on the kick drum, and in both cases you got a huge undefined sound. It's bad enough that they used it on the kick , but using it on the bass rig as well pretty much guarantees that the bass and the kick will be fighting for the same space, and in the process making a big pile of mud. Having said all of this, it's quite possible that youth's bass rig could be dialed in a little better on stage as well, who knows. The new record has some great bass sounds on it, and none of them showed up for the gig in Boston. - CP






-----Original Message-----
From: fluw <fluwdot at earthlink.net>
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Sun, Dec 5, 2010 2:43 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] NYC Reviews? sound issues



It used to be that bands were mixed withthe vocals as the dominant and the other instruments are added to fill in.these days drums are the focal point of a mix, where you might be able to hearthe ting off the bell on the ride cymbol or the drummers flatulations betterthan the guitar or the lead vocalist.

But with bass it is even worse these days,as the instrument Is pumped through the PA, when that sound from the bassreaches the speakers it is out of phase ( out of time ) with the sound comingfrom the bass amplifier on stage. Phase cancellation occurs at this point whichrenders the bass frequencies into an incongruent mass of mud.

The bass issue can be solved by asoundperson using a phase aligner that will delay the bass sound coming fromthe PA until it matches the throw of the bass frequencies coming from the stagebass amplifier. This is very rear to find sound techs who comprehend such asimple notion however.

Solving the drums being the center of the mixissue is easy as well. Just mix the drums to follow the vocals and guitar in amplifiedintensity and the mix will be remarkably clear and punchy and powerful.







From:gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of ceplaster at aol.com
Sent: Sunday, December 05, 20105:52 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] NYC Reviews?


Irespectfully disagree with the one-note live band thing. While theyabsolutely are a loud live band, the one-note thing comes as much fromthe sound man as it does from them. At last nights show in Boston, There was more dimensionality coming off the stage than was comingthrough the pa. As far as live mixing goes, the more you try to pushguitar and bass guitar so you can really hear what they are doing, the morecomplicated the mixing gets. A lot of live sound guys avoid that so thattheir mixes sound cleaner and more "pro", at least to them. Also, the bigger the venue, the messier guitar heavy mixes start tosound. There is definitely an art to mixing this way, and it is not theeasiest way to mix a band. In any case, with KJ, if the guitar andthe bass aren't mixed loud and clear, you miss a lot of what is going on. - CP


-----OriginalMessage-----
From: GREG SLAWSON <gregslawson at msn.com>
To: gathering <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Sun, Dec 5, 2010 12:45 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] NYC Reviews?

I think anotherissue w/the set lists is live, KJ are somewhat a different being thanon record. They've recored albums w/several different
not just styles, but moods, feels, attitiudes, etc (for ex, the weirddissonance of Revelations, the accessibility of BTATS, the arty hard rockof Extremities,
the trance/metal of Pandemonium, the ultra serious apocalyptic metal of 2003,etc. BUt live they're a one-note band--all about the volume, force,
wall of sound, catharsis. So they tend to pick the songs for live shows thatfit w/that!



Date:Sun, 5 Dec 2010 22:41:08 +0000
From: phil.tofield at virgin.net
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] NYC Reviews?

Spot on...



unlikelythough

On 5 December 201022:34, Alexander Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net>wrote:



Just once .... I'dlove to hear "Chop Chop" and "Let's All Go (To the Fire Dances)".Just once.



Alex in NYC






On Dec 5, 2010, at4:02 PM, Wessidetempest wrote:



They did do king andqueens on pandemonium tour.

Devils advocatehere.

They toured the shitout of extremities before and after the album came out. So maybe they're sickof it.

I took would likestuff off of revelations.

Don't really careabout wardance much anymore. Requiem still gives me chills. I still live theguitar and keyboard riff. I'm glad they arenfinally easing up on pandemonium. Iliked 2003 so id prefer something other then asteroid. Hell give me onesong off of hosannas just because we never got it in the states.



Oh well. Beggarscan't be choosers. But beggars can be gatherers.



Chris


On Dec 5, 2010, at 3:43 PM, PHIL TOFIELD <phil.tofield at virgin.net> wrote:


It kind of pisses meoff that they seem to completely disregard about 90% of their back cataloguenow. Nothing from Revelations, nothing from Fire Dances, nothing from Brighter,nothing from Extremities (I never really liked Extremities era, but TermiteMound was great live), nothing from OTG (cough....), nothing from Democracy....



It would be good ifthey'd throw in a couple of curve-balls now and again though, Darkness BeforeDawn, Song and Dance, The Hum, Twilight of the Mortals, Kings and Queens,Pandys, the full rap version of Stay One Jump Ahead....



(ok strike that lastone...)

Im not complaining, its great that they are still touring and are stillsounding so good live, but do they absolutely have to playWardance/Pssyche/Requiem et al. at every single gig? A bit of variety from theback catalogue wouldn't go amis.



Good to hear thatthe gigs are going down well over the pond.



On 5 December 201013:47, Alexander Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:



I know Youth didn'tplay on the album, but would it KILL the band to play a track off of FIREDANCES? Youth didn't play on NIGHTTIME and they still do "Love LikeBlood" and "Eighties."



Alex in NYC








On Dec 4, 2010, at8:55 PM, sade1 wrote:






Same here.

Though I'm not thrilled by that setlist(30 fuckin' years[32+!!]of workand that's whatthey choose??) I will prolly go see them because I am getting theimpression this will be the last time we will see them Live.







From: "LONESTYLE at aol.com"<LONESTYLE at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Sat, December 4, 201012:00:47 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] NYCReviews?

Alex,





That will be us too when they play LA.Just enough time for a pee and a drink plus maybe a smoke too if we arelucky. ;) HA!





~ LB








In a message dated 12/4/2010 11:54:33 A.M.Pacific Standard Time, vassifer at earthlink.net writes:


"This World Hell" was mygoing-to-the-men's-room-then-getting-another-beer song.










In a message dated 12/4/2010 8:34:33 A.M.Pacific Standard Time, jonniespatula at hotmail.co.uk writes:

SET LIST.

Tomorrow's World
Love Like Blood
Absolute Dissent
Wardance
In Excelsis
Bloodsport
European Superstate
Madness
Fall of Because
Ghosts of Ladbroke Grove
Eighties
The Great Cull
The Wait
This World Hell
Requiem
Asteroid
Pssyche

Change
Complications
Pandemonium








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