[kj] OT: Speaking of Bo Diddley...

[ade]

My inability to get this across right is down to my lack of music theory knowledge, though I guess
I know what these things are, just don't know their names or rules. Hence the rules *can* go out
the window. But anyway, I'll try!
 
He sort've *moves around* the beat, dropping different accents in, whch can move with or against
the beat, etc. So you often get that thing where he totally changes the landscape of a tune when he
drops in, accenting different parts of the bar to what the bass, drums & vocals are. Like offsetting the
whole thing so it no longer seems like a regular 4/4 beat. I guess add the tribal drumming & it sounds
all over the place, though as you say, they like 4/4. I think they want the steady, pounding delivery of
4/4 & then embellish it to fuck. Particularly earlier on.
 

-----Original Message-----
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On Behalf Of Bette Dillinger
Sent: 07 June 2008 22:22
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: Speaking of Bo Diddley...


Well, the time signatures are pretty basic on songs like "Follow the Leader", etc, and I believe the main things that define Geordie's playing aside from his remarkable dexterity are delay, reverb and distortion.....especially on a song like "The Hum".  Time signatures are pretty easy to hear if you say, compare the bass to the drum beat (Pink Floyd's "Money" is 7/4....just count the bass beats and it becomes pretty understandable).
  But please, guitar geeks, tell me if I am wrong!  I am not an expert regarding the guitar by any stretch of the imagination (pun intended).  This is just information I know from local guitarists whose sound I think is fantastic, and that is the verdict.  I can see it when I play, but obviously there is no way I can play like Mr Walker.   Ain't my forte
-Bette   




  _____  

Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2008 11:09:02 +0100
From: ade at the-lab.zetnet.co.uk
To: saulomar1 at yahoo.com; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: Speaking of Bo Diddley...


He does indeed mix it up rhythm-wise. I wouldn't say there's any specific time-signature, he'll
mess about within the current time everyone is in. He's a bastard ;)

-----Original Message-----
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On Behalf Of sade1
Sent: 07 June 2008 01:02
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: Speaking of Bo Diddley...


For all the guit'enthusiasts on here,
  i read somewhere last night that Bo Diddley tended to use a certain time-signature as part of his trademark rhythm/sound. I think they said it was 5/8 [i know nothing about time sigs, i couldn't tap out a 4/4 if my life depended on it]
   My question is, doesn't Geordie also use a certain rhythm/time-sig in lots of his work? I hear something constant in lots of his work and i thought maybe it's a time-sig or similar.
 


 


... ... ... ... ... ... 
(looking at the current state of things)

'Save me..                                                
 save me from Tomorrow..                          
 I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...!'   


--- On Fri, 6/6/08, ade <ade at the-lab.zetnet.co.uk> wrote:


From: ade <ade at the-lab.zetnet.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: Speaking of Bo Diddley...
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" <gathering at misera.net>
Date: Friday, June 6, 2008, 2:30 PM


Totally pioneering - I think it took someone like Hendrix to then come

along & mutate that rhythmic barrage of Diddley's into the 'next

step',

or progression.



All fucking Alchemists in my mind. Nevertheless, I'd say the ideas behind

something like Geordie's use of slap-back delay on lots of Nighttime goes

directly back to Rock'n'rollers, Rockabilly, etc. As you say, the

'twang'.

Dirt that twang up slightly, add chorus, turn up the repeats on the slap-

back & you have the bells of Nighttime!



Even Hank Marvin was initially awe-inspiring, with tape-delay, trem, etc.



I think those sounds had a profound effect on Geordie. Sabre Dance, for

fuck sake - says it all, really. As well as the influence of the earthy

rhythm (& lead) gods such as Angus Young & Jimmy Page & the

intellectualism

of John McLaughlin.



If guitars hadn't been big boxes all those years ago, with all that fat

bottom-end, it might not have become the rhythmic instrument it is today!







-----Original Message-----

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net

[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On Behalf Of B. Oliver Sheppard

Sent: 06 June 2008 21:20

To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)

Subject: Re: [kj] OT: Speaking of Bo Diddley...





Ade,





Yeah, that's an incredible video.



The thing I like about Diddley's style, I am finding out (I always 

ignored or avoided him because he seemed like someone my parents would 

like, which meant I would automatically shun it, and I missed out on 

some decent stuff because of that stubborness) -- is his really weird 

utilization of the more percussive, chunky, chunk-chunk-wokka-wokka 

aspects of the guitar that are amplified through certain types of 

distortion. And the way he effortlessly maneuvers across the fretboard 

while swinging the damn thing around. The opening of, for example, 

Killing Joke's "Tabazan," where Geordie does that weird,

palm-muted 

"chukka-chukka-chunk-chunk" thing before playing outright

identifiable 

notes -- that is the kind of thing I guess Diddley was going way back as 

early as the 50s..????



The Sun Records crew, god bless them, in the 1950s were more interested 

in Western-style twang for their rockabilly. I like that style, too. But 

Diddley was going down this really chugga-chugga, chikka-chikka type of 

guitar path that wasn't fully exploited until heavy metal came along, 

when you would have regular palm muted "rhythm guitar" essentially 

trying to play counterpoint to the drumming, chugging along to the 

drums. I'm not an uber-scholar, but from all I have seen, it looks like 

Diddley is one of the pioneers of that aspect of rock guitar.



That video you posted is indeed pretty incredible.



-Oliver



ade wrote:


> Excellent Olly! Here's another!



>



> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgzn7VyoqEw&NR=1



>



> We're all standing on the shoulders of giants, innit.



>



>



>



>   




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