[kj] FW: Re: Funny KJ tracks?

Brendan bq at soundgardener.co.nz
Wed Aug 1 16:24:21 EDT 2007

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Yeah I see your point, but what about ants? Bees? Other primates? Animals
that hunt and live in packs...? We aren't the only animals that
co-operate. And there is still competition within tribes, including for
mates...last time I checked they weren't handing out pussy ration tokens.
I suggested it to the local council but no reply...

So many docos and books I read have sentences with something like "the
thing that makes humans different from all the other animals is", but I
don't think there's necessarily any one thing. I agree that our level of
co-operation is second to none. But we have self awareness (the sapiens
sapiens part of homo spaiens sapiens means "aware that we are aware"),
language, the ability to analyse and self-correct behaviour, the ability
to form abstract thoughts far and above any other animal etc. I am not
enough of an expert to say which one of them is the single most
distinguishing factor, but I get frustrated with people's, including
scientists's, blinkered, black and white analysis.

> Like armies - they work together.

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net on behalf of GREG SLAWSON

> Sent: Wed 8/1/2007 6:29 AM

> To: gathering at misera.net

> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Re: Funny KJ tracks?

>

> Brenden, two things: First, I think you're talking about the "fight or

> flight" response that humans are hard-wired for, which is different from

> the need for warfare. Second, it's true that humans at one time had to

> compete for mates, but the advances in human intelligence and such came

> about largely through being able to act collectively, as a group, rather

> than just compete for stuff. For example, in primitive societies (remnants

> of which still exists in some places), tribal groups cooperated by sharing

> food, child care, etc. Members of a tribe did not compete for resources,

> but cooperated in order to make everyone better off. THat's why humans

> were able to evolve well above other animals: they no longer acted alone

> but cooperatively and socially in may ways.

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> From: "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>

> Reply-To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the

> band!)"<gathering at misera.net>

> To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)"

> <gathering at misera.net>

> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Re: Funny KJ tracks?

> Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 12:03:15 +1200 (NZST)

> >Every single one of us is descended from thousands of generations of

> >people (and before we were "people") who all had to fight tooth and nail

> >to survive and reproduce, and every single one of them did. All of our

> >ancestors fought successfully for their own survival and the survival of

> >their offspring, often to the death, out-competed their rivals for

> mates,

> >and mated. (And eventually karked it, but that's life...)

> >

> >It's only been in the last few thousand years that we've needed more

> >advanced skills, we're still hard-wired to respond to stress with

> terminal

> >physical aggression, or olympic-record winning sprints in the other

> >direction. It was totally necessary to get us to where we are now.

> >

> >Sabre-toothed tigers can't be put on hold or told to leave a voicemail.

> >And you can't really rip out your bank managers throat with your teeth,

> or

> >anyone who disagrees with you philosophically or economically etc. Well,

> >you can, perhaps, but only once ;)

> >

> >The diplomatic approach doesn't really come naturally, in my opinion,

> you

> >need to overcome your internal Conan the Barbarian instincts first...

> >

> >"KRUSH YOUR ENEMIES, SEE DEM TRIVEN BEFOR YOU, HEAR DA LAMENTATIONS OF

> DA

> >WOMEN"

> >

> >

> >

> > > <html><div style='background-color:'><DIV class=RTE>

> > > I disagree w/parts of Jaz's doomsday quotes. I don't

> think

> > > man needs war in some instinctual or genetic way--it's capitalism

> that

> > > needs war. If certain countries don't destroy others through war,

> their

> > > corporations will not be able to stay on top. THe economic laws of

> > > capitalism require each capitalist (or group of them) to make MORE

> profits

> > > than others, in order to get a greater market share than their

> > > competitors. THis is the main cause of all modern wars--all the other

> > > stuff like religion, nationalism, revenge, territory--are just

> expressions

> > > of what the capitalists need. Cases in point: in Iraq the biggest

> > > negotiating topic between Iraqi groups and America is over control of

> oil;

> > > in WWII the Europeans were fighting over colonies in Africa, Asia,

> etc.

> > > and the war served to boost capitalism by destroying production

> (mostly in

> > > Europe & Japan, currently the world's stongest economies?) so

> they

> > > could increase profits by rebuilding.</DIV>

> > > <DIV></DIV>

> > > <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT:

> > > #a0c6e5 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> > > FONT-FAMILY: tahoma,sans-serif">

> > > <HR color=#a0c6e5 SIZE=1>

> > >

> > > <DIV></DIV>From:  "B. Oliver Sheppard"

> > > <bigblackhair at sbcglobal.net> Reply-To:  "A

> list

> > > about all things Killing Joke (the

> > > band!)"<gathering at misera.net> To:  "A list

> about

> > > all things Killing Joke (the band!)"

> > > <gathering at misera.net> Subject:  Re: [kj]

> FW:

> > > Re: Funny KJ tracks? Date:  Tue, 31 Jul 2007

> 13:42:53

> > > -0500 >Actually, I just found it sort of ironic that we're

> > > discussing wacky >KJ moments, or the lack of them, when I was

> > > re-reading these old Jaz >interviews and he's basically

> discussing

> > > a global holocaust as >desirable or at least

> > > unavoidable/"necessary." That kind of gloomy, >nihilistic

> worldview

> > > contrasted with "funny moments in Killing >Joke!" just strikes

> me

> > > as itself sort of funny. Meh, maybe I'm not >explaining this

> > > right. Also, Jaz cracks me up sometimes when he >talks about

> how he

> > > has his church with a huge congregation,

> > > etc. > >-Oliver > > >melinda grant

> > > wrote: >> >>i agree with this quote of jazes

> below(i

> > > know,laugh,but i do!) >>sounds pritty sensible when you

> think

> > > about

>  >>it...........................    

> > > ;-)  oliver,how is this below >>quote funny? its

> > > bloody true of the future,anyway ;-/ >> >>>From:

> "B.

> > > Oliver Sheppard"

> > > <bigblackhair at sbcglobal.net> >>>Reply-To: "A list

> about

> > > all things Killing Joke (the

> > > >>>band!)"<gathering at misera.net> >>>To:

> "A

> > > list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)"

> > > >>><gathering at misera.net> >>>Subject:

> Re:

> > > [kj] Funny KJ tracks? >>>Date:

> > > Tue, 31 Jul 2007 13:16:55 - >>> >>>What about

> > > interview w/

> > > Jaz? >>> >>>quotes:  jaz >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>"Look,

> > > the ending when it comes won't be through a nuclear war or

> > > >>>atomic bombs or any of that shit. It'll be natural

> > > disasters like >>>earthquakes and floods. It's just the

> > > earth's way of cleaning >>>itself and getting rid of the

> > > natural waste. It's like everything >>>- life, rock and

> roll

> > > and the world: it all goes in circles and >>>when the

> time

> > > comes the world will get rid of all the crap and

>  >>>those who

> > > survive will start a new civilisation, much better than

> > > >>>the last one." - Jaz Coleman,

> > > >>>http://www.anirrationaldomain.net/articles/1979-1982/nme0581.h >>> >>>-Oliver >>>*................................................................................... >>> >> >>actually

> > > i agree with jaz  on that one-- saying it

> > > again  ;-D))) >> >>melinda >>>_______________________________________________ >>>Gathering

> > > mailing

> > > list >>>Gathering at misera.net >>>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering >> >>_________________________________________________________________ >>The

> > > next generation of Hotmail is

> > > here!   >>http://www.newhotmail.co.uk >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Gathering

> > > mailing

> > > list >>Gathering at misera.net >>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering >> > >_______________________________________________ >Gathering

> > > mailing

> > > list >Gathering at misera.net >http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering </BLOCKQUOTE></div><br

> > > clear=all><hr> <a href="http://g.msn.com/8HMBENUS/2752??PS=47575"

> > > target="_top">i'm making a difference.?Make every IM count for the

> cause

> > > of your choice. Join Now.? </a> </html>

> > >

> > > _______________________________________________

> > > Gathering mailing list

> > > Gathering at misera.net

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> > >

> >

> >

> >_______________________________________________

> >Gathering mailing list

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>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> PC Magazine's 2007 editors' choice for best web mail-award-winning Windows

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