[kj] Miks DVDs
ade
ade at the-lab.zetnet.co.uk
Fri Mar 11 15:23:17 EST 2005
So we're just talking about the promo videos & that's it?
-----Original Message-----
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On Behalf Of Rob's Arse
Sent: 11 March 2005 17:27
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] Miks DVDs
By official release I mean the soundtrack to the video. The video is promoting a studio recording and the argument is that rather than bootlegging, it could be contrued as counterfeiting, though at no time did Mik ever say his were official recordings. But I'm just explaining some of the rationale behind the move. I own all of Killing Joke's catalogue, but I don't own the videos cos they've never been released.I agree that people won't divert their money to other Killing Joke product but the fact that he was making money out of Killing Joke product and Killing Joke weren't is the route of the problem
--- "peter.west410" <peter.west410 at ntlworld.com> wrote:
From: "peter.west410" <peter.west410 at ntlworld.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 17:04:50 -0000
To: <joker at Z6.com>,
"A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" <gathering at misera.net>
Subject: Re: [kj] Miks DVDs
Mik was making a nominal amount of money,Coins instead of notes.Enough for a
little drink at the end of the month .........pocket money,And for the
amount of effort he put on ,then i feel this is justified.
So these people who cannot buy Miks stuff,Will they be spending money on
other KJ products?No.Because these people are hard-core fans who already own
all of KJs back catalogue.
What official release are you referring to...............Sorry Im
getting a bit narked..............Its Ades fault,But id rather not talk
about it.
PW
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob's Arse" <joker at Z6.com>
To: <ade at the-lab.zetnet.co.uk>; "A list about all things Killing Joke (the
band!)" <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Friday, March 11, 2005 4:43 PM
Subject: RE: [kj] Miks DVDs
Ade dear, you may misunderstand me.
I'm not against Mik selling his stuff but my point is that, if you're going
to stop someone doing soemthing, then replace it with something better. I'm
just offering a little more detail into the reason why he was asked to stop.
And at £5 dvd, you can make money. I buy blank DVDs for 26p. cases for
10p, jiffy bags for 12p and postage would be 50p. At £5 a pop, Mik would
actually be making more money than the band would likely get on an official
release!
The fact that KJ keep missing business opportunties no longer surprises me!
--- "ade" <ade at the-lab.zetnet.co.uk> wrote:
From: "ade" <ade at the-lab.zetnet.co.uk>
Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 14:48:29 -0000
To: <wittz at starsandmoon.plus.com>, "'A list about all things Killing Joke
(the band!)'" <gathering at misera.net>, <joker at Z6.com>, "'peter.west410'"
<peter.west410 at ntlworld.com>
Subject: RE: [kj] Miks DVDs
Nice one Brian - sums it up really. No, I don't agree with Rob, but as he's
a bit closer to the band,
he has been given a different outlook on this. Shockingly, I do agree with
Pete. Fact is that Mik was
doing KJ a favour & not himself. Helping to keep their market alive. Well,
if they wanna be like that, 4k 'em!
ade.
-----Original Message-----
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On
Behalf Of Wittz
Sent: 11 March 2005 13:00
To: joker at Z6.com; 'A list about all things Killing Joke ' (the band!);
'peter.west410'
Subject: [kj] Miks DVDs
I agree with what has been said by Rob and Peter.
Although Mik may have been selling them I think covering costs etc may
have been the motivation behind it.
Now this is making a profit from the bands work and an entilerly different
matter (unless this is official and got under my radar)....
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=307&item=4706997695&r
d=1
Brian.
On Fri Mar 11 11:49 , 'peter.west410' <peter.west410 at ntlworld.com> sent:
As far as I know all the stuff on Miks site were bootlegs and
unavailable
anywhere else, And I would confidently say that no-one has brought
something
off Miks site INSTEAD of buying from the shops,We are left with the
situation today of there being no place to buy live KJ DVDs,If they had
loads of titles available in the shops,then i could understand the
reasoning
.But now we are left with a void.
As I said before that KJ should of got all Miks DVD ,took all the best
bits and turned it into a three hour "best of",given away with the first
batch of the new official DVD.Left Mik open,So people who wanted more
,could
purchase them
Actually KJ did request a copy of all of Miks
mastertapes.......................Opppssssssss..............I do go on
at
times.
PW
(Unfortunately they got a negative response)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob's Arse" <joker at Z6.com>
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)"
<gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Friday, March 11, 2005 8:58 AM
Subject: Re: RE: [kj] bpf
Your'e right Pete, it would have made sense to formalise the videos
thing
but there is much more to it than that.
Basically, Mik was shut down because he was selling the stuff. I think
Mik's
a top fella but can understand the reasoning as it wasn't his stuff to
sell.
Essentially he was selling studio recordings in the form of the videos
and
it "could" be considered that this would be the same as if someone was
selling mp3s of the official recordings.
Bootleg gigs are slightly different but its a very fine line.
The best thing would have been to have git an official video /dvd
together
and then close down Mik.
--- "peter.west410" <peter.west410 at ntlworld.com> wrote:
From: "peter.west410" <peter.west410 at ntlworld.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 15:54:18 -0000
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)"
<gathering at misera.net>
Subject: Re: RE: [kj] bpf
Do you know the reasoning for the management banning Mik's site?
He was nt making much money,selling a nominal amount.And there is no
official release of these recordings.It would of benefited everyone if
KJ
would of bought Mik on board,Advertised the site as official and charged
10
quid for a DVD.Everyone a winner.And I hope Mel never made an official
complaint about money and got Mik shut down.................ooopppsssss
Me
and my big mouth.
PW
----- Original Message -----
From: <bernies at ntlworld.com>
To: <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2005 3:40 PM
Subject: RE: RE: [kj] bpf
> No, that's just to do with bootlegging. It's difficult to see how
Mik's
videos would have affected sales of the legitimate product but let's not
start that discussion again!
> jerry
> >
> > From: "ade" <ade at the-lab.zetnet.co.uk>
> > Date: 2005/03/10 Thu PM 01:20:40 GMT
> > To: "'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'"
<gathering at misera.net>
> > Subject: RE: RE: [kj] bpf
> >
> > Cheers for that, j. The business of royalties, et al, has always
been
> > somewhat confusing to me. Now I get the idea behind publishing -
probably
> > why Mik Raven was asked to stop selling bootleg vids, etc.
> >
> > Hmmm...
> >
> >
> > ade.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
> >
[gathering-bounces at misera.net','','','')">gathering-bounces at misera.net]On
Behalf Of bernies at ntlworld.com
> > Sent: 10 March 2005 10:47
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Subject: Re: RE: [kj] bpf
> >
> >
> > None of the band probably get any royalties from their first ten
years
of
> > record sales. Any royalties earned are used to pay back advances,
recording
> > and marketing costs before the band sees a penny. KJ's royalty rate,
in
> > aggregate, is probably no more than 10% of the price the dealer pays
for
the
> > record and I doubt they've recouped what was spent on Outside the
Gate,
let
> > alone the previous six albums.
> >
> > I'm pretty sure, however, that they've recouped their publishing
deal
with
> > E'G hence they should all be getting royalties from performances,
cover
> > versions, etc.
> >
> > I don't suppose they'll ever see a penny from Jaz Summers, though.
> >
> > Any questions?
> > j
> > >
> > > From: "ade" <ade at the-lab.zetnet.co.uk>
> > > Date: 2005/03/08 Tue PM 07:55:53 GMT
> > > To: "'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'"
> > <gathering at misera.net>
> > > Subject: RE: [kj] bpf
> > >
> > > bpfSo... Mike has morals enough to pay C4B royalties to BPF, but
is it
the
> > > case
> > > that BPF gets no other royalties? For all those groundbreaking
albums
he
> > > played on & that sound he helped create?
> > >
> > > Smacks of a lesson learnt from Atkins!!!
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
> >
[gathering-bounces at misera.net','','','')">gathering-bounces at misera.net]On
> > > Behalf Of mike coles
> > > Sent: 08 March 2005 19:32
> > > To: gathering at misera.net
> > > Subject: [kj] bpf
> > >
> > >
> > > "As for Wardance, I'm sure Big Paul is still getting royalties...:
> > >
> > > No he isn't.
> > >
> > >
> > > oh yes he is...
> > > from malicious damage records for chaos for breakfast which has
two
> > > versions of wardance on it
> > >
> > >
> > > cheers,
> > > colesy
> > > --
> > > check out the shop at http://www.maliciousdamage.co.uk
> > > if you want to receive the monthly malicious gossip tell us at
> > > gossip at maliciousdamage.co.uk
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
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> > >
> > >
> >
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